Great basketball teams

**Biggin** · February 20th, 2011, 06:05 PM

I love basketball. Its far and away my second favorite sport. HS, College, NBA, whatever. Its a one of a kind sport. Theres nothing as exciting as the best athletes in the world playing against each other at a high level.
But theres something in basketball thats found in every other sport.

The best teams, the teams that win championships, whether its at the HS, NCAA or NBA level, have an edge to them. A toughness, a grit that wills the team to the win. Physical style of play, with at least 1-2 players who will get in your face and play you as hard as you have ever been played before. The great teams dont rely on finesse to win, they rely on hard fought toughness to win. Physicality.
The Lakers have had guys like Artest, before that Boston has Garnett and Perkins, and the Spurs had Bruce Bowen. Guys that would do everything they could to break you, get you off your game. Doing everything inside (and outside) the rules to win the game.

But a team will never be great without that toughness, that heart, the ability to drop in the dirt and FIGHT to win. Thats not saying finesse teams cant win games, but they dont win titles. You have to have one player willing to fight for his team. Willing to give a very hard foul to set the tone early. Willing to give their body for the team.

Without that, no team will ever be the best. If 2nd best or 3rd best is your goal, thats fine.
But if you wanna be the ELITE team, the best team, you gotta fight for it. Earn it.
Its the same as football. Theres gotta be a guy that will lay out the opponents out, set the tone in the first minute.
James Harrison is not a great athlete. He isnt the fastest guy, the biggest guy, the strongest guy, but he is the guy thats willing to knock you the **** out to set the tone. He is willing to show you that if you are gonna beat MY team, you gonna have to FIGHT for it. You gonna have to EARN every second of it.
Its the only way to be great.
The Packers had it in Desmond Bishop, Lakers had Artest, every NHL team has at least one "enforcer", the Giants had guys like Huff, etc...

**Unchained** · February 20th, 2011, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by Biggin

I love basketball. Its far and away my second favorite sport. HS, College, NBA, whatever. Its a one of a kind sport. Theres nothing as exciting as the best athletes in the world playing against each other at a high level.
But theres something in basketball thats found in every other sport.

The best teams, the teams that win championships, whether its at the HS, NCAA or NBA level, have an edge to them. A toughness, a grit that wills the team to the win. Physical style of play, with at least 1-2 players who will get in your face and play you as hard as you have ever been played before. The great teams dont rely on finesse to win, they rely on hard fought toughness to win. Physicality.
The Lakers have had guys like Artest, before that Boston has Garnett and Perkins, and the Spurs had Bruce Bowen. Guys that would do everything they could to break you, get you off your game. Doing everything inside (and outside) the rules to win the game.

But a team will never be great without that toughness, that heart, the ability to drop in the dirt and FIGHT to win. Thats not saying finesse teams cant win games, but they dont win titles. You have to have one player willing to fight for his team. Willing to give a very hard foul to set the tone early. Willing to give their body for the team.

I have seen alot of that this year with the Kelly boys. Toughness,grit,determination..I have seen them rally from sizeable 4th qtr deficits many times this year. I have seen them show tremendous poise and refuse to be rattled. Basketball is not my favorite of the sports,but I sure have enjoyed watching this bunch this season. There is nothing finesse at all about this bunch.

**Biggin** · February 20th, 2011, 06:37 PM

Last 10 Super Bowl champs:
Packers (Desmond Bishop)
Saints (Will Smith, Roman Harper)
Steelers (James Harrison)
NY Giants (Antonio Pierce)
Colts (Bob Sanders)
Steelers (Harrison)
Pats (Rodney Harrison/Richard Seymour)
Pats (Harrison)
Bucs (John Lynch)
Pats (Harrison)
Ravens (Ray Lewis)

NBA:
Lakers (Artest)
Lakers (Fisher)
Celtics (Garnett/Perkins)
Spurs (Bruce Bowen)
Heat (Haslem/Shaq/Zo)
Spurs (Bowen, Steven Jackson)
Pistons (Ben Wallace/Rasheed)
Spurs (Bowen)
Lakers (Shaq)

In physical sports like the NFL and the NBA, teams that have an edge and play rough and have that guy who will give the hard foul or lay the hard hit win.

**Biggin** · February 20th, 2011, 06:39 PM

Originally Posted by Unchained

I have seen alot of that this year with the Kelly boys. Toughness,grit,determination..I have seen them rally from sizeable 4th qtr deficits many times this year. I have seen them show tremendous poise and refuse to be rattled. Basketball is not my favorite of the sports,but I sure have enjoyed watching this bunch this season. There is nothing finesse at all about this bunch.

I agree with that. Its not really about poise in the sense im talking about (although poise is very important), but JJK has a kid or two that is very physical and set the tone early with in your face, pressure D and the beating and banging inside.

thats why GC was great all those years, they were never shy about being in your face physical.

**pvfan** · February 20th, 2011, 07:02 PM

Tell me the last NCAA Champion that had a player like this? It comes down to how the games are called. The basketball that I see in person most frequently is not basketball, its beat you to death and out depth you. You don't see this stuff in the ACC, Big Ten, SEC, etc. I do hope something happens at PV, and it's not just basketball. We haven't had what I would call an enforcer in any sport since Dakota Cantrell left and we have suffered for it.

**Biggin** · February 20th, 2011, 07:30 PM

Duke had Zoubek and the Plumlees, guys that were physical down low.
The way games are called, in the NBA and in HS basketball, are a lot alike. They let the players play, and the games are more physical than not. The NCAAT is called more closely, but the physical style of play still wins.

Duke was more physical than Butler, UNC had Hansborough, Kansas/Memphis was a helluva physical game, Florida had Horford, etc...
All those teams played physical basketball

**starbuck** · February 20th, 2011, 07:56 PM

[QUOTE=Biggin;1856678]Last 10 Super Bowl champs:
Packers (Desmond Bishop)
Saints (Will Smith, Roman Harper)
Steelers (James Harrison)
NY Giants (Antonio Pierce)
Colts (Bob Sanders)
Steelers (Harrison)
Pats (Rodney Harrison/Richard Seymour)
Pats (Harrison)
Bucs (John Lynch)
Pats (Harrison)
Ravens (Ray Lewis)

QUOTE]

that SB against the Seahawks James Harrison wasn't the cog that made it work. their linebacking corp was lead by Joey Porter. here were the starters - Joey Porter, James Farrior, Clark Haggans, and Larry Foote. Harrison was there but wasn't the player we know now.

**pvfan** · February 20th, 2011, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by Biggin

Duke had Zoubek and the Plumlees, guys that were physical down low.
The way games are called, in the NBA and in HS basketball, are a lot alike. They let the players play, and the games are more physical than not. The NCAAT is called more closely, but the physical style of play still wins.

Duke was more physical than Butler, UNC had Hansborough, Kansas/Memphis was a helluva physical game, Florida had Horford, etc...
All those teams played physical basketball

Zoubek and the Plumee brothers are a lot of things, physical is not one of them.

**Biggin** · February 20th, 2011, 11:09 PM

wait what? you are seriously gonna say that Zoubek wasnt a big physical defender?

Hes not Kendrick Perkins, but he added that physical inside play for them. He would take charges and give hard fouls

**pvfan** · February 21st, 2011, 12:27 AM

Zoubek is in my opinion the worst starting center in the history of the game to play for a national champion. Last year's Duke team is also the least physical team I've ever seen win the tournament. Their entire game was based on three point shooting and ball pressure.